Will Those Condemned to Hell See Jesus Again?

You serpents, you brood of vipers, how will you escape the sentence of hell?  (Matt 23:33)

Jesus, in this "woe" passage, all but condemns the scribes and Pharisees, listing their sins and hypocrisies.  In spite of Jesus great desire to gather them to himself, they were "unwilling." (v. 37).

However, there is an interesting sequel:

For I say to you, from now on you will not see Me until you say, "Blessed is He who comes in the name of the Lord!" (Matt 23:39)

Here, plainly, Jesus speaks of the scribes and Pharisees seeing Jesus again.  "Fine," you say, "that's just the judgment."  Oh, really?  Do those who are going to eternal judgment bless and honor the one who is becoming King?  This is the same announcement that the followers of Jesus gave back in Matt 21 on Palm Sunday (v. 9).  Could this be the confession of those who have endured a judgment and are finally returning to the Lord at some later time (perhaps post "hell?").  Consider setting aside traditional views of the Pharisees end and test the scripture. 

And his lord, moved with anger, handed him over to the torturers
until he should repay all that was owed him.
(Matt 18:34 Jesus' parable of a king wishing to settle accounts with his slaves, emphasis mine)

Why, if Jesus was illustrating end time judgment, did he give an end to the servants torture?  Will there be a time when the Pharisees will have paid back "all that was owed" to the king?  Will they see Jesus again and bless Him?

so that at the name of Jesus Every knee will bow of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and that every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father. (Phil 2:10-11)

Faithful Plans of the Lord

O Lord, You are my God;
I will exalt You, I will give thanks to Your name;
For You have worked wonders,
Plans formed long ago, with perfect faithfulness.
(Isaiah 25:1 NASB)

Consider what the Lord will do:

The Lord of hosts will prepare a lavish banquet for all peoples on this mountain;
a banquet of aged wine, choice pieces with marrow and refined, aged wine. (Isaiah 25:6)

 The Lord wants to break bread with "all peoples"--draw close to them, fellowship with them.  A meal with God is a powerful convenantal venture. God (through the 3 visitors) had a meal with Abraham when he promised him a son.  He had a meal with the elders of Israel on the Holy Mountain before Moses ascended to receive the commandments.  And so on.

And on this mountain He will swallow up the covering which is over all peoples,
Even the veil which is stretched over all nations. (Isaiah 25:7)

The Lord is going to remove the veil, the blindness of all peoples, all nations.  What a wonderful benefit!  There are so many things even we followers of Jesus don't see.  I'm sure you have as many questions as I do!

He will swallow up death for all time,
And the Lord God will wipe tears away from all faces,
And He will remove the reproach of His people from all the earth;
For the Lord has spoken. (Isaiah 25:8)

No more death, no more tears.  This unimaginable prospect is a promise of God!  No tears and no death will be a reality for all.  Those suffering and those living at peace will share this promise.

Consider that one of those "wonders," one of those "plans," is the final redemption of all. 

Now that would be a wonder!

Mr 16:15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel (good news) to every creature.

Lu 2:10 And the angel said unto them, Fear not: for, behold, I bring you good tidings of great joy, which shall be to all people.

Example of todays version of the Good News...or Does this pass the Good News test?

“Your grandma is going to hell forever but you’re not cause you trusted in Jesus.”
... I would call this a good news FAIL.

“You are definitely going to heaven when you die… but unless your children trust Jesus, I’m sorry but they will never get to heaven, but in fact they will be tormented day and night endlessly.”
…good news FAIL.

“Your wife is going to make it to heaven, but unless you trust Jesus and truly believe, you’re going to hell forever.” It’s up to you… Jesus died for you…” ...
Good News FAIL.


HOW ABOUT SOME REAL GOOD NEWS:

1Ti 4:10 For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

2Co 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

1Jo 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

1Co 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.

Ro 11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

1Ch 16:34 O give thanks unto the LORD; for he is good;
for his mercy endureth for ever.

Ps 118:4 Let them now that fear the LORD say, that his mercy endureth for ever.

Joh 6:37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.
Joh 3:35 The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand.

Joh 12:32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.

Re 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

1Co 15:26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

1Co 15:55 O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory?

Good news??? Pass!

Scary Hell

I recently saw a sign on a business saying, "If you knew what Hell was like, you would accept Jesus."

I am confident that the people who put up the sign wanted more people to know Jesus, to find hope and live a joyous life.  Its hard for any one phrase or bumper sticker to send the full message of life that people need to find.  I can think of many reasons, however, that this sign would get just the opposite response. 

Many people think they know what Hell is like.  Maybe they just lost a son or daughter to cancer.  Maybe they just lost their home or job.  Maybe they just went through a divorce or difficult relationship break up.  These ordeals can bring such torment, that in comparison to "normal" life, it is Hell.  No doubt many who see this sign feel patronized.

Some people think entering into the religious world is Hell.  How many people that you know have experienced great grief through the Church failing to love unconditionally?  How could this person understand that the Jesus we are offering isn't the same "Jesus" they experienced in the last Church fellowship they were in?  Why change the Hell they know for the more difficult Hell they think they know?

I'm sure I could go on, but enough of negative thinking. 

Consider the message of the traditional Hell.*  Is eternal torment consistent with scriptural teaching?  Is it consistent with the Character of Christ?  Does eternal damnation match up with the Law (eye for an eye, etc.)?  Does the suggestion of an unjust eternal future affirm to people that Christianity (as falsely advertised) is just another "religious Hell?"

If you knew what Jesus was like...

*Note: The basis for our understanding of Hell is Scripture and Scripture alone.  You will find many scriptural supports here and elsewhere for God's redemption of all mankind.  We do not pursue universal salvation because it is reasonable or politically correct!

Invitation

God loves you.  He is pursuing you.  His love never fails.  He will win you.  I cannot tell you what pride or rebellion you need to surrender.  I cannot see what is keeping you from the freedom that God wants you to experience.  I don't know what yoke/imprisonment you need to trade for His yoke, His enslavement.  I could name things I might see but still miss the beautiful work God is doing in you.  You must answer Him.  You must either face or run from Him on your own.  I pray you grasp the solid life that Jesus is holding out to you right now.  Your "life" for His.  Your "world" for His.  Believe me, this is a trade up--but it definitely has its costs too.

He made Him (Jesus) to be sin on our behalf that we might become the righteousness (exchange our dead living for his life) of God.  2 Cor. 5:21

Finding Bedrock

MUDDY WATERS
My Family and I love the outdoors.  Rivers, lakes, and the ocean are wonderful playgrounds.  Where my wife and I enjoy the calming scenery of these places, my kids would rather throw rocks or sticks, wade in and splash.  They can't stand it until they've muddied the waters!

When it comes to Biblical doctrine, perhaps Jack and I have unintentionally created the same feeling for you.  Questioning the supposed foundations of our faith can weaken your spiritual legs or muddy the waters, so to speak.  Instead of throwing you for a loop, I want to encourage your deeper study of scriptural doctrine. 

The truth is, I've lived what I feel was a blessed and mostly content life before I was exposed to the possibility that Hell, as most Christians hold it, is not biblically supported.  The idea that Hell might not be eternal first confused me then led me on a challenging quest.  You, too, can go on ignoring this debate and still enjoy a rich life with Jesus!  However, I think you will be richer still, if you test this doctrine as I did.

SOLID GROUND
I want to take a moment to stand with you on solid ground.  Loving and gifted teachers taught me that the Bible, tradition and experience help solidify the Christian's faith.  The Bible witnesses as source, tradition as helpful counsel and experience as affirming testimony.  But do take care--the farther away from the source you travel the more opportunity for error.

These wonderful verses exemplify the power and authority of scripture:

II Tim. 3:15 & 16 says that "All scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness; that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work."

The apostle Peter also exhorts us to "remember the words spoken beforehand by the holy prophets and the commandment of the Lord and Savior spoken by your apostles." (I Pe 3:2)

Scripture is reliable and today accessible in the original languages to even the most ill-equipped of believers. (You can find free versions of computer Bible programs like Bible Explorer, etc. on the web).  Even without the aid of the original Hebrew and Greek, you can spend time with a concordance studying the usage of individual words like "eternal" or "hell" (like we have here!).

WHAT IS SIGNIFICANT?
Years ago, I attended a church service in which Carol Wimber, wife of Vineyard leader John Wimber, spoke.  John had recently passed away and Carol and a friend stood up and began alternately speaking about the role of Jesus in each of the books of the Bible, Genesis through Revelation.  They began with "He is the Creator" and ended a long time afterward with something like "He is the Alpha and Omega!"  It was a wonderful time of worship and put paid to any doubt concerning the central role of Jesus throughout the Bible.

I believe the Bible testifies to every foundational doctrine in a similiar way.  If it is significant, it is not obscure.  Consider the following bedrock doctrines (Just a short list!):

Doctrine                                     Books Referring To (of the 66 books of the Bible)
The Spirit of God                        
(his personage, his actions, etc.)   (At least 46 of the 66)
The Love of God
(As specifically referred to)            (At least 25 of the 66)
The Sin of Man
(Where the word "sin" occurs)       (At least 39 of the 66)

This does not mean, of course, that the virgin birth of Christ is an obscure doctrine because it is not mentioned throughout the Bible.  This doctrine is part of the bigger doctrine of the character of Christ present in some form in every book of the Bible.

Now lets look at Hell, (Is it a rock solid doctrine?):
The Doctrine of Hell (traditional)
(or a place of eternal torment)          (Occurs in 5 books in the NT only)

We dispute the existence of a place of eternal torment, as you may know by reading our other posts.  However, please note that in it's biblical "footprint" alone, the traditional Doctrine of Hell is very lonely.  The OT knows nothing of a place of eternal torment.  Paul, who wrote most of the NT writes nothing about it.  It seems pretty important to me that if people around me were in danger of being tormented forever, that the warnings against this danger would be far more prolific.

The word Hell (gehenna) occurs 12 times in the books Matthew, Mark, Luke & James.  The word Hell (tartaroo) occurs 1 time in the book of 2 Peter.  There is also another Greek word used for Hell in the King James and it occurs 10 times in the New Testiment.  I did not include this word because it clearly does not refer to a place of eternal torment.  It is the Greek word hades which means the "unseen" or the "grave" and in addition to Matthew and Luke, it occurs in Acts and Revelation.  The Greek word hades is equivalent to the Hebrew word sheol used 65 times in the Old Testiment.  Confusingly enough, the word is used in the King James OT 31 times as "Hell," 31 times as "grave" and 3 times as "pit."  There is no description in the Old Testiment of an eternal torment for sinners (amazing, huh?).

Herein, I have taken on just one of the pillars of the doctrine of Hell: It's solidness/not so solidness.  In other posts we have addressed individual references to Hell and why they do not match up to the traditionally held position.  As always, we welcome your comments and questions.

The "bedrock" doctrines unite us as believers.  I do not think there is a place for the Doctrine of Hell (as tradition holds) in Christianity.  But if you insist, then please do not put it alongside the other clearly defined "bedrock" doctrines of our faith.  It muddies the waters!

Love Never Fails

Universal Salvation. ...even so through one act of righteousness there resulted justification of life to all men. Ro 5:18
All will be saved. [God] desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of truth. I Ti 2:4
The Reconciliation of all mankind. For it was the Father's good pleasure for all the fullness to dwell in him, and through him to reconcile all things to himself... Col 1:19-20
Good news to all men. Behold, I bring you good tidings of great joy which will be to all people. Lu 2:10

These are still new ideas to me.  I casually live out my life, running my business, buying groceries, driving around the Southland, occasionally remembering that everyone will be won by our Lord.  I forget that the blood of Jesus now triumphs over the sin and debt of every man, woman, boy and girl.  I find myself surprised by the power of God's intervention in a person's life.  Not one will be left to wander in darkness.  God will leave the 99 to pursue the 1.  A lifetime of believing in the tradition of eternal torment for those who don't follow Christ in this life hinders my thinking.

I am not surprised that you, the reader, have a hard time taking in this "new" idea.  I can only guess at the emotions I would feel, the offense I would have taken five or ten years ago. All kinds of statements come to my mind concerning taking such a "heretical" path away from the tried and true course.  I remember many past judgments I have declared concerning the behavior and beliefs of other Christians.  I smile.  Now I am marginalized, I am the irrational thinker, I am the one reaping the scorn and derision.  And well I should be humbled, one always quick to contradict another's reason, often speaking before thinking, so full of "truth" and short on love.  I really enjoy God's humor in all this!

Inherent in all this is the love of God.  It has never changed.  I have changed and will change some more.  You have changed--your doctrine, your convictions.  We are not the idealists of yesterday nor will we remain as we are in years to come. 

When I consider how best to persuade you of the truth of God's promise of life for the world, I weigh the two extremes.  Should I show you how scripture gives consistent witness, how those proof texts for an eternal Hell are mistranslated and tradition is god for most Christians?  Or, should I show you that the character of God proves out our convictions?

Here in this blog we are trying to do both.  Scripture texts and the character of God revealed in scripture powerfully testify to God's desire to reconcile "all things (Col 1:19-20)." 

The crux of the traditional doctrine of Hell rests on God somehow taking a lobotomy at the end of this life.  His grace, love and power become harsh judgment, hate and powerlessness as he must now sentence most of his created beings to torment without end.  He is inexplicably unable to win them and save them.

I long for you to see that the God who never fails, the One with the keys of Hell and of Death, will accomplish what he has set out to do.  He will win them all!

For the grace of God has appeared bringing salvation to all men, instructing us to deny ungodliness and worldly desires and to live sensibly, righteously and godly in the present age, looking for the blessed hope and the appearing of the glory of our great God and Savior, Christ Jesus; who gave Himself for us, that He might redeem us from every lawless deed and purify for Himself a people for His own possession, zealous for good deeds. Titus 2:11-14